Fist Report #22: You Might Want to Actually Read This One


Fist Report #22: You Might Want to Actually Read This One


Message from the Fist

Aloha DB Gamers! There is a lot to cover this month. Major change to the GMRG. If you read nothing else in this report, you need to read this section. Update to the Rites of Combat to cover Clan Feud and Cooperative events, a new activity, and some competitions.

Here’s the TL;DR.

  1. Major GMRG Change (you really should read this)
  2. ROC Change for Clan Feuds and Co-op Events
  3. More stuff for Destiny 2
  4. Warframe looking good. On you to make it happen!


GMRG Leaderboard Change

Getting this out of the way up front: PvP Score will be the only way to win the GMRG Leaderboard beginning 1 October.

What IS Changing

For nearly four years, the Grand Master’s Royal Guard Leaderboard has been a PvE/PvO centric event. GMRG members raced against each other for 90 days to determine who could earn the most Clusters of Earth and Fire. I have watched this event for nearly two years. It is almost always the same people in the top spots, and it is almost always a landslide victory. The number of points (1 per CE and 2 per CF) earned by the first place member is sometimes two to three times higher than the 6th place and below members. This doesn’t show an event based on skill. It shows an event based on who has the most time to dedicate to playing/submitting screenshots. I don’t think this is what the GMRG Leaderboard was originally intended to do, and I don’t think it is how it should continue to function. The GMRG leaderboard should highlight the most skilled players, not those who simply play the most video games.

So, once this quarter ends, the GMRG Leaderboard will no longer be a cluster race. It will be about who can attain the highest PvP Score. James is working the coding now, and it will go live after the 3rd Quarter results post. I will not change a quarter two-thirds of the way through. This change has been in the works for months, and was discussed with the DC and your Consuls prior to going into effect.

So, why did I do this? Short answer: because this is the most fair method I can think of to rebalance the GMRG. I did a lot of math (which I hate doing) to see how much of a disparity existed between the current method and the PvP centric model. I was shocked at how much different they were. I was also surprised at the difference in the names on the different top 10 lists. The PvE/PvO names are generally pretty constant. Lots of the same names and faces. In a PvP centric model, the playing field is completely level (no, I’m not posting that list). Want to win? You have to actually win matches. This is not Win/Loss ratio. This is PvP Score, which is defined as Wins * (Wins/Matches Played). You will have to play and WIN matches in order to have the best PvP Score.

Take a look at the charts below. In the PvE/PvO Chart (Current Model), the difference between first place and 5th place is astronomically different over the course of the past seven quarters. The difference between first and 10th place is even larger. That doesn’t show a high level of skill. It shows a large amount of free time.


Compare this with the score distribution to the model we are moving to. In a PvP Score centric model, there are four outliers (all of those occurred during competitive events where members were constantly queuing and going up against some of our more skilled members.


What IS NOT Changing

The method to rank up in the GMRG is not changing. The comprehensive total of Clusters of Earth/Fire and Pendants of Blood are still the path to rank X. The requirements are listed on the GMRG Wiki PageOnce you get to rank X and qualify for the leaderboard, you’ll need to start playing some PvP matches if you want a shiny new accessory.


Rites of Combat Update: Clan Feuds and Cooperative Events

Cland Feuds and Cooperative events are great ways to hone your competition skills in between major DB events. Gaming events generally draw large crowds, especially those that are focused on PvE/PvO gaming.

Currently there is no restriction in the RoC for PvE/PvO Gaming in terms of matchmaking. You can play with whomever you want, whenever you want, and if there is someone you’d rather not play games with, you don’t have to play with them. That works for casual play. It becomes a bit of a problem if you are taking part in a feud or cooperative event and you find yourself being left out of gaming events because a team from the other clan/team is trying to win.

The Justicar and GM have reviewed and approved the following addition to the Rites of Combat to cover Clan Feud and Cooperative gaming competitions.

“In a joint or vs. event between two (or more) clans, all gaming submissions must contain at least one player from the opposing unit(s). In the event that a member on an opposing Clan/Team does not own a game, the group will play a game that is available to all members that wish to be part of the submission.”

Just like the GMRG change, this was dialogued with your consuls prior to its addition.


Gaming Updates: Destiny 2 and Warframe Test

Destiny 2

Two modes added for Destiny 2.

Gambit: Live on the site now, will not accept Gambit submissions until 4 September. Gambit is a PvE/PvO Hybrid game mode that pits your team against another in a race to gather enough motes to summon a boss. First team to defeat their boss wins the round, matches are best of three rounds. Because of the PvO mechanic, this game mode will qualify for Clusters of Fire.

  • PvO Gaming ---> Destiny 2 ----> Crucible/Gambit
  • 2 CFs per Match (assumes you win both opening rounds), modifiers for group size.

Private Matches: Live on the site. Normal Rites of Combat Apply. 1v1 Matches are live on the bot now.

Warframe Test

The Warframe test is going well. Remember, you hold the keys to the success or failure of this test.

38 people said they would play.

28 people signed up.

10 have already participated.

Get after it. 15 participants is the magic number.


##Brotherhood Gaming League Update

Update on the Future the Brotherhood Gaming League

First and foremost, I want to thank everyone who has participated in the BGL thus far. It has been a VERY exciting process for me. You’ve been helpful in sharing what you’ve liked, what you haven’t liked, what is popular and what is not.

Here’s the sum up of what I’ve learned: given the waning interest and sign-ups, the current format is unpopular. I had initially planned for the BGL to highlight the highest skilled gamers in the Brotherhood in specific games, but after discussion with Dracpool and the rest of the Fist Staff, we’ve concluded that this ambitious plan has not come to fruition.

This does not mean the end of the BGL, it just means that Season Two will have a MASSIVE overhaul in the way we operate in two major categories: length of season and separation of games. We are working out the specific details, but instead of being four overall winners, there will be ONE overall winner.

Still ambitious? Yes. But after discussion, research, and experience, we feel it’s a much more viable and exciting option for the Brotherhood’s Gaming Community. So keep watching Fist reports for updates!

This all being said, we STILL need to play out the finale of Season One, but it will be expedited dramatically. All three remaining games are gonna happen all at once. If you adhere to the schedule, this will mean that if you sign up for HS, OW (PC), OW (PS4), and HotS, you will have to play 4 games a week. That’s not all that daunting a task.

Remember that sign ups for these will qualify you for the dossier awards! If you don’t sign up now, you can’t qualify for the Champions Tournaments, which are invitation only based on standings in these games!

Round Two: Heroes of the Storm, Overwatch, and Hearthstone!

Heroes of the Storm

We’re moving into the Heroes of the Storm part of Stage Two! This will be run a little different this time. We’ll be doing 1v1 with only TWO AIs. This essentially forces you to be more reliant on your own skills and less on the RNG of your AIs. The biggest issue stated from earlier was that the game was too reliant on AI. This should help with that aspect.

I am extending sign-ups for Round Two HotS by ONE week. You now have until Sept. 7th to sign up.

Competition details can be found here.

You can sign up for it Heroes of the Storm here!


Just as last time, we will be running two separate OW events, PS4 and PC. It will again be Limited Heroes 1v1 which can be set up in Custom Match.

You can sign up for Overwatch here.


We’ve just recently seen the launch of another Hearthstone expansion! To celebrate, you will face off against each other using Year of the Raven Standard decks!

You can sign up for Hearthstone here.

Round Two: Jedi Academy

Our Round One winner, Blade, has won Round Two, thus passing the automatic berth granted over to the runner up, Raiju Kang! Raiju, congrats on your automatic berth into the Champions Tournament!

Champions Tournament Standings

(note: You will have to select “Current Standings” from the bottom tab)

Jedi Academy Champions Tournament Standings

Heroes of the Storm Champions Tournament Standings

Overwatch - PC - Champions Tournament Standings

Overwatch - PS4 - Champions Tournament Standings

Hearthstone Champions Tournament Standings


Fist Sponsored - Gaming Competitions:

[FIST] 2018 Monthly Gaming Challenge - September

Gorefest- September 2018

Diablo 3: Season 14

Brotherhood Gaming League: Season 1


Admin and Policy Reminders

All current Gaming and Fist Policies can be found on the Gaming Information page. I suggest that all members read this page as it has some great info. I will make sure this page stays updated to reflect all current office policies. I do not want to confuse anyone, especially with what is and is not allowed in the DB Gaming Telegram room.

Other items of note:

  • The staff has 24 hours from the time you submit gaming activity to approve it. If your submission has been sitting for longer than that, there is a problem. If it hasn’t, there is no problem. The staff do their best to process gaming submissions as quickly as possible, but they are real people with real lives. I do not expect them to sit behind a computer processing gaming submissions all day, and neither should any of you.

  • Solo submissions are never acceptable for Clusters of Earth/Fire. My staff and I will reject any that come in. You must play with at least one other DB member, no exceptions. This is not changing any time in the near (or far) future.

  • Pendants of Blood are not acceptable for submission to cluster-counting competitions. If we see them, we will remand the request.

  • Reminder: Feel free to run Gaming competitions DB wide. Gaming is a slightly different community, and is one of the few that consistently brings club members together outside of the competitive environment. Most of the people I currently game are all in different clans. By opening up your event DB-wide, you increase the pool of possible participants, which could allow for a crescent upgrade!

  • Reminder: While I sincerely appreciate having proposals/great ideas sent to me via telegram, please email the staff list (email is at the bottom of this report). I ask that your House and Clan leadership take a look at your proposals before you send them up. This isn’t to add a layer of bureaucracy, it’s because I’m sure they’d like to know how you are trying to help the club improve...helps with award and promotion recommendations and all that. Feel free to cc them on your email to me and my staff.




  1. Major GMRG Change (you really should read this)
  2. ROC Change for Clan Feuds and Co-op Events
  3. More stuff for Destiny 2
  4. Warframe looking good. On you to make it happen!


This one was big. This is a major change to a system that has been in place since I joined the club. Like every change I make or recommend, I did not do this without data and discussion with the club’s leaders. I believe this is truly in the best interest of the DB.

Good luck, mahalo, and keep on gaming.

-Dracpool, out.


Looking forward to seeing how the changes effect things.

Regarding the ROC change, why did the Dark Council feel the need to intervene in what is essentially a comp runner's prerogative? As a former Consul this feels like micromanagement to me, especially in the context of a coop event. I can see it for a feud but in all multi-clan events? Every clan is different and this takes the flexibility away from unit leaders to fashion competitions that work for them. Any time I ran a multi-unit event I worked with the other leaders to fashion a competition that was 1) most fair to both units and 2) maximized enjoyment for all the members. When I did a feud with Plagueis we did pvp score only because we felt a cluster race would favor COU too much. When I did coop events we tended to cluster races so people could play what they wanted to play and have fun, which was appropriate for the laid back coop format. I can think of a few issues with this policy being mandatory. Hypothetical: COU and CNS want to run a laid back coop event, Overwatch is far more popular in COU but HOTS is more popular in CNS, under your mandatory rule both clan populations have a hard time finding matches in their game of choice and get stuck playing Hearthstone or something and hardly anyone has fun. And that's not even touching on the issue of availability of gamers from the other clan to actually game. During the COU/PLA feud for example COU had noticeably more gamers and there was a shortage of opponents and members were frustrated with the lack of matches. I think the rule you adopted should only be mandatory for clan feuds and cooperative events or other events without the stakes of a full feud should be at the comp-runner's discretion.

Regarding the GMRG changes, I wholly accept the premise that the GMRG as it currently existed needed to change. I've consistently ranked in the GMRG for almost 3 years and it has needed a shake up for some time. However, I do not believe PVP score alone was the answer. It has just as many flaws and pitfalls as cluster counters, especially with platforms like Force Arena which reward grinding (and possibly real world money) with higher level units that we have no way to mitigate like we can with basic only rules in Hearthstone. We'll see how it goes. Issues with PVP aside I do know there was a proposal in the works some time ago that would have modeled the GMRG on the comprehensive point system used by the fiction society (e.g. took things like competition placements, ACC wins, etc into account as well as raw clusters). Was that considered before this decision was made? It seems like there are alternatives to PVP score that could have been explored.

@turel thank you for your comment. Response below:

  1. This is to prevent competitive cluster race competitions where one clan can box another out from participating. Why include cooperative events? They are still joint events, they still yield awards, clusters, credits, and stats on unit health. It only seemed fair that the first requirement made the second necessary. This was approved by both the GM and JST, and discussed by the CONs. Either Juna or I will (as always) review gaming comps that are submitted to ensure the rules are clear and fair for participants. Your leaders still have some freedom of maneuver.

  2. There were so many options, but this was the one that worked the best. Others involved some pretty epic coding. As per your comment on the GMRG change that made it like the fiction society, I was one of the people that wrote it. In the end, how you rank up isn’t changing. At some point, it should be a COMPETITIVE event, not a time sink. That has been a complaint since day one of my time in this club. If this doesn’t work, I’ll do my job and continue to work to find something that does.

I'm liking the changes! Very nice to see this.

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